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Author Topic:   GAY MEN.. AND .WHY WE LOVE THEM!
g2
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posted February 01, 2001 04:12 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for g2     Edit/Delete Message
It's a frightening world...

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Skinnylb
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posted February 01, 2001 05:34 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Skinnylb   Click Here to Email Skinnylb     Edit/Delete Message
It's just soo sad..that anyone today should have to be in FEAR for his life ..just because of who they love..i'ts sad..and it REALLY pisses me off!..

but on a lighter note..Will & Grace is on tonite..woo hoo!

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cstengel
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posted February 01, 2001 05:46 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for cstengel   Click Here to Email cstengel     Edit/Delete Message
No offense intended here (and I'm not necessarily trying to defend anyone), but in reference to a post about 5(?) back that Skinny had issues with, a friend of mine who's gay uses the term "queer" without any negative connotations at all and actually told me that I can use the term when speaking about homosexuality, etc. While I've got not issues with anyone's sexual preference, I was concerned that should I ever use the term I'd be misinterpreted as being hostile towards gays.

I realize that it's different for someone on the inside of any of these issues to use a word or phrase towards themselves (I really feel uncomfortable even typing it, but like the way some blacks will refer to each other as "niggers").

Just wondered where you all thought the term "queer" stood at this point. Just curious.

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jpgordo
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posted February 01, 2001 05:58 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for jpgordo   Click Here to Email jpgordo     Edit/Delete Message
If you're straight, you shouldn't call gay men "queer". That's the answer.

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cstengel
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posted February 01, 2001 06:04 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for cstengel   Click Here to Email cstengel     Edit/Delete Message
Even if your gay friend tells you that you should???

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jpgordo
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posted February 01, 2001 06:15 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for jpgordo   Click Here to Email jpgordo     Edit/Delete Message
I can't imagine a gay friend saying "Please, call us queer. We like that." Unless I'm so far out of the gay loop, that I've lost touch. What would you say if your friend said, "Please, call us fags. We prefer fag."

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Skinnylb
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posted February 01, 2001 08:33 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Skinnylb   Click Here to Email Skinnylb     Edit/Delete Message
..I have gotten on our mutual Gay friend about the term that he very casually tosses around..He has jumped on my if I have used that term..as in (and this is the ONLY way i have said this word)..If I find somthing very dumb or stupid I might say.."That is so Queer" ...Or "Queer shit" NOT directing that terms towards any person....I have corrected myself and no longer say that..
I do understand that many minorites call themselves by the terms they would Kick anyones Ass who called them that..but I guess that is just the way it is...Cant change it.....
and I do think a person can tell wether a term is used derogitory or a person is playing around(as in between friends)...but in General I dont think that term should be used at all...

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cstengel
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posted February 01, 2001 08:50 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for cstengel   Click Here to Email cstengel     Edit/Delete Message
See, I think the key is right there. You're using the term as a replacement for "stupid", "dumb", etc. I think it would be just as offensive to use the term "gay" in that sense despite you guys seeing nothing wrong with the term "gay". I think what he is saying is that it's acceptable to use it in the sense that it's a synonym for "gay" (in the nonjudgemental or viscious sense). Like saying "Jack realized when he was 14 that he was queer". I think when you use ANY term in the sense that it's a substitute for "dumb", "stupid", etc., THAT'S when it becomes bad. It's not the words you're using, it's what's behind them.

[This message has been edited by cstengel (edited February 01, 2001).]

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jollyjoe
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posted February 01, 2001 09:40 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for jollyjoe   Click Here to Email jollyjoe     Edit/Delete Message
Are these label discussions really necessary? Shouldn't everyone just instinctively know what's right and wrong? And what is offensive and non-offensive?

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Skinnylb
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posted February 01, 2001 09:46 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Skinnylb   Click Here to Email Skinnylb     Edit/Delete Message
Of course I was wrong in the way I used the term!! (No excuse but I picked up that bad habit from someone ALONG time ago) and as I said..I am VERY careful NOT to use that phrase at ALL anymore..I never meant it to sound the way it did..and when I was called on it..I realized how Ignorant I was being..

BUT he himself will use that term about himself and friends and it's ok....I accept that..Do I understand it?..No...

And YES we all should quit talking about it.. and JUST KNOW BETTER...!

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mollyglover
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posted February 01, 2001 09:51 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for mollyglover   Click Here to Email mollyglover     Edit/Delete Message
It's all in the way things are said. I agree. In some conversations you can say that a friend of yours is queer... it's all about inflection and tone and meaning and context and all of that. If you think you are saying something that sounds bad to someone else, then you probably are.

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cstengel
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posted February 01, 2001 10:09 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for cstengel   Click Here to Email cstengel     Edit/Delete Message
I just don't think it's as simple as some of you suggest. I don't think it's something completely guagable via instinct. In some circles you could throw the word "bitch" around and it doesn't mean a thing where in others it's a big deal. Some people feel comfortable cursing "Jesus Christ" while others are really offended at it. At one point using the term "negro" was the preferable way of saying "black" but I don't think you'd that term around now.

I don't have any misconceptions about us coming to any answers here (just seeking opinions). But I don't think the answer is just to avoid something because it bothers ONE person. If you look hard enough (and you really wont have to) you can find someone that's going to be bothered by ANYTHING you might say.

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jpgordo
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posted February 01, 2001 10:47 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for jpgordo   Click Here to Email jpgordo     Edit/Delete Message
Do you make a habit of saying things that are acceptable in some circle and unacceptable in others? I think it's just basic human sensitivity to the crowd you are with. You should know your friends and they should know your intent. They should also know if you're joking. If you're with strangers, the general rule is to not say anything that would ever be perceived of as offensive.

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g2
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posted February 02, 2001 07:09 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for g2     Edit/Delete Message
"Queer" is defined as: 1. differing from what is usual or ordinary; odd; singular; strange 2. slightly ill; qualmish or giddy 3. doubtful; suspicious 4. [Colloq.] having mental quirks; eccentric 5. [Slang] counterfeit; not genuine 6. [Slang] homosexual

The sixth definition was derived from slang use of the first three, primarily the first. I don't particularly care for slang in any form as it deteriorates language. But in this case (as in many) it is particularly offensive to me.

To use a term that means different in a derogitory manner illustrates the greatest human flaw: zenophobia. As I've said before, we should embrace our differences for that is how we learn. And again, how mundane, ORDINARY, and sad a world this would be if everyone WERE the same.

I completely agree with you jpgordo. There's line in "Divine Secrets of the Ya-Ya Sisterhood", something to the effect of, 'If you can't figure out anything else in life, try good manners.'

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Skinnylb
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posted February 02, 2001 11:57 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Skinnylb   Click Here to Email Skinnylb     Edit/Delete Message
Leave it to g2 to tell it like it is..!!!..I may rule the boards..but I have NOTHING on the way g2 can put thought into words...She is VERY cool!...

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